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NCDD-DISCUSSION  December 2008, Week 1

NCDD-DISCUSSION December 2008, Week 1

Subject:

Re: Please Endorse This Democracy Agenda

From:

Bill Potapchuk <[log in to unmask]>

Reply-To:

Bill Potapchuk <[log in to unmask]>

Date:

Sun, 7 Dec 2008 14:29:59 -0500

Content-Type:

text/plain

Parts/Attachments:

Parts/Attachments

text/plain (377 lines)

Greetings.  Kenoli has raised some important points and I am sure others
have similar concerns.  I was one of the participants at the event that led
to the Agenda for Strengthening our Nation's Democracy.  Since Kenoli asked
many questions in this email and others, I thought it might be helpful to
respond from my own perspective and share why I think it is important to
endorse this document and help move this agenda forward.

There are several principles that undergirded work on this document (once
again, from my perspective):

First, we had a very small window of opportunity, it needed to be seized.
President-elect Obama and his transition team are making -- and have already
made -- important decisions regarding all of the issues and opportunities
facing the country and his presidency.  One of the most important tasks for
the Transition Team is setting priorities.  While Obama spoke at many times
about the importance of citizen (or civic or public) engagement,
co-production, and service there were very few specific ideas on how to
operationalize this aspiration in his platform, the Blueprint for Change,
except in the area of service.  While there were several from the family (D
and D types, Dispute resolution types, collaboration types) on some of
Obama's policy committees, near as I could tell, none of the ideas around
these citizen engagement and collaboration made it to the lists of top
priorities.  One of the main goals for this gathering was to develop some
clear recommendations (and we were counseled by members of his policy
committee to ensure there were only a very small number of recommendations
and, I believe, McCain's folks offered similar advice) that could get into
the hands of key people so the new administration had some specific ideas
around how to operationalize the President-elect's vision and could make it
a priority.

Second, there is a shared interest in not endorsing any particular process.
There were proponents of many different, and sometimes competing, approaches
in the room.  I think, and believe others share, the basic idea that no
particular process is the right process for every situation, every setting,
every issue.  It was more important to generate a commitment to real
(authentic, meaningful, . . ) citizen engagement in the new administration
than sift through all of the competing claims and ideas about various
processes for this document.  That is a conversation to be had (once again,
my perspective) that should be, in part, situation specific.  For example,
look at how we reacted on the NCDD listserv to the use of change.gov as a
web platform for health care reform.  I think some of the ideas that
surfaced were superb and would help ensure the engagement was more
meaningful -- more co-intelligent! -- on this important issue.  Those same
ideas might not be as relevant or appropriate to the development and
implementation of Promise Communities (a short description is below) and
creating 20, local, community-specific, comprehensive, ambitious community
engagement, community building processes.

Third, no matter which way one looked, there were practitioners and
stakeholders and consumers not in the room.  I and others spoke about this
in the small and large group discussions.  Again, only speaking for myself,
I think we will be successful if we get a commitment to this agenda from the
new administration and one of the first steps is to broaden the
conversation.  No matter how much conversation we do in the NCDD or any
other practitioner communities, that is not the same as engaging mayors,
governors, public officials, community based organization, local
intermediaries, community leaders and host of others on the ground . . and
it is not the same as engaging the new leadership of this country --
Domestic Policy Council, secretaries and lead staff from a host of federal
agencies, and others on the federal side of the table -- those who will be
actually charged with major responsibility around this kind of agenda.  I
actually think it would be counterproductive for our practitioner community
to develop a more specific agenda without these other kinds of stakeholders
in the (virtual) room.

Fourth, pairing those interested in civic engagement with those interested
in electoral reform created some interesting possibilities as well as some
challenging tensions.  Ultimately, both communities share a similar
interest, broadening involvement in the political process.  I know in my
state (Virginia), a group of people (many say Republicans) circulated an
email that said because of the large electoral turnout that was expected,
Republicans should vote on November 4th and Democrats should vote on
November 5th.  This is one of countless efforts to make sure some voters
were disenfranchised.  I think the D and D community should stand up and
support all efforts to broaden participation in electoral and other kinds of
political processes.

Lastly, part of my practice has been working with coalitions that have been
advancing similar agendas with the new administration on issues important to
them.  My work has been in the education and children and youth and
education arenas and I have been watching efforts around urban development,
racial equity and other issues.  It is clear to me, watching and
participating in these efforts, that agendas that have a broad range of
support are more likely to be taken seriously.  

This is our chance to be taken seriously, to support some broad ideas that
give our work a home (White House Office of Civic Engagement), a way to
begin a conversation about legislation (the public participation act), and a
big goal (a truly national conversations and deliberations about national
issues).  We can also be allies to those who are working hard to broaden who
participates in electoral processes (could we ever have a universal right to
vote?).  Once we have partners in the new administration around our broad
agenda, we can "walk the talk" and make sure the further development of this
agenda is inclusive, collaborative, and effective.

Best to all,

bill

Establish 20 Promise Neighborhoods: Obama and Biden will create 20 Promise
Neighborhoods in areas that have high levels of poverty and crime and low
levels of student academic achievement in cities across the nation. The
Promise Neighborhoods will be modeled after the Harlem Children's Zone,
which provides a full network of services, including early childhood
education, youth violence prevention efforts and after-school activities, to
an entire neighborhood from birth to college.


Bill Potapchuk
Community Building Institute
8718 Mary Lee Lane
Annandale, VA  22003
703.425.6296 v
703.425.6297 f
[log in to unmask]
www.communitybuildinginstitute.org


-----Original Message-----
From: NCDD Discussion List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] On
Behalf Of Kenoli Oleari
Sent: Saturday, December 06, 2008 5:49 PM
To: [log in to unmask]
Subject: Re: [NCDD-DISCUSSION] Please Endorse This Democracy Agenda

I would like to get into all of this more, as I think it is important  
and don't have a hunk of time to do it just now.  Something I'd like  
to concur with you, Joe, about here is something that AS is not always  
as up front about: that a high part of what drives AS is the capacity  
to influence Washington policy, as is.  This means, asyou say, that AS  
often makes choices that do significantly compromise the potential  
effectiveness of their events.

I want to point to two issues this raises for me:

1.  Since they are holding what they do up as an example of good  
citizen participation, it is this model that many people walk away  
with.  I think the AS model is not very different than what is already  
done, incrementally better, perhaps.  In this respect, I think it does  
not help people understand or become more conversant or knowledgeable  
about what is possible regarding citizen based democracy.  I think  
this is a big danger.

2.  The part of the evaluation you give, joe, of the California  
process describes greater participation in the political process, as  
is, again.  it does not open up new kinds of engagement and new kinds  
of participation, simply more of the same.  One key aspect of real  
participatory democracy that was missing in the AS health care  
conversations (and there are many others) was really, full  
participation.  For instance, there was no significant participation,  
if any of actually decision makers in the events themselves.  It was  
entirely set up as a consultative process to send statistical data to  
the legislators, at best and, perhaps, as you point out, to encourage  
more involvement in our rather broken system as it is.  You can never  
get enough of what you don't need.

This may be an improvement of what already exists; it does not  
introduce people in any way to new ways of engaging, nor does it  
increase their intelligence or competence when it comes to public  
participation.  It carries a strong message that bigger and more  
technological means better or more democracy.

What I see in the document we are asked to endorse, is nothing more  
than proposing that we make what we already do regarding public  
involvement a higher priority.  I wouldn't argue definitively that  
this isn't somehow better than what we have, but it might not be, it  
might even be worse.  This is more of what was done in the round of  
reform that we got through NEPA and the generation of legislation that  
was enacted around NEPA.  It hasn't really given us anything that is  
better than what we had before, though it did get rather bad public  
involvement on the table, requiring everyone to do it; at this point,  
it is the status quo and it is not working.

I think AS is shooting too low and one reason for this is that it  
created this proposal in consultation with a small group (If the  
sponsorship on the document is accurate) who are largely experts in  
policy and have little expertise in process, namely the study circle  
folks (now called Everyday Democracy) and Demos.org.  While the study  
circles group has provided some useful tools for bringing people  
together, it does not do a lot regarding large scale democracy and  
search as I might on the Demos web site, I could not find a familiar  
name in democratic process, nor anyone who even claims to even  
practice it.  It is pretty much policy people, advocates and academics.

If people who are actually involved in large scale participatory  
democracy were brought in to building this proposal, I think ti would  
be a much better proposal and a proposal much more likely to be  
listened to and adopted.  I think one reason this was not done is that  
these organizations really don't know how to do something effective,  
practical and timely with a large diverse group.  In fact, nearly  
everything they do comes from a small core group of experts, setting  
things up for others or collecting and interpreting data from a larger  
group.  I'll bet they might say, "If we tried to do this, we'd never  
actually pull anything together."  We hear this all the time and then  
demonstrate to people that they can, if they use an effective  
participative approach based on principles and practice that work.

There are lots of people in the world who know how to convene very  
large groups of people and produce effective outcomes that are able to  
make use of the broad wisdom available through true diversity.  When  
you retract to a small group of experts, you limit what you get to  
what those experts know.  This is a key flaw in our existing system  
and I think AS does not function very far outside of the existing  
system.  It does not effectively collaborate with others, nor does it  
convene others in ways that really empower them or learn from them.  I  
think it just doesn't know how to do this.  (Maybe they do, though  
they have never demonstrated it in practice that I have seen, and I  
put a lot of time into supporting AS events.)

So, if you want something that is about the same but a little better,  
support this proposal.  If you want to bring something forward that  
really responds to the world situation in a way that is effective and  
timely, don't deceive yourself into thinking that this is what this is.

Of course, most of us don't have the resources to fly around the  
country and meet with "important" policy people or find our way into  
the offices of Washington insiders because we have established  
relations with them, or hire consultants and graphic designers to  
produce impressive documents for us.  So our proposals and the timing  
of them are not going to emerge with the speed, gloss or professional  
credentials of AS's proposal.  But, ultimately they may be able to  
respond in a deeper way to what is actually going on in the world and  
to include all the voices, not just the professionals.

Just don't fool yourselves that what AS proposes is much different  
than what we already have.  It may be more of the same and a bit of a  
tweak in a good direction but it is nothing really different.

Warmly,

--Kenoli


On Dec 6, 2008, at 11:47 AM, Joe Goldman wrote:

> I'd like to weigh in on this thread as well.
>
> As Susanna noted, I'd encourage folks to take a look at the agenda  
> itself.
> It consists of three central components: (1) a champion in the
> Administration that works to advance democratic participation in  
> terms of
> electoral reform, civic engagement, etc.; (2) a proposal that the  
> president
> call for regular national discussions of millions of people -- this  
> does not
> presume a specific method or approach, rather that the president  
> acknowledge
> that the public should have a seat at the table; and (3) a legislative
> agenda that includes broad electoral reform along with a public
> participation act that would reduce barriers to Federal engagement  
> of the
> public as well as legislation that would welcome new immigrants into  
> our
> nation's democratic process.
>
> It is certainly the case that this agenda doesn't include everything  
> that
> one might want, but it was an attempt to bring together some  
> advocates for
> greater civic engagement with those who care about electoral reform  
> and
> community building, and find ideas that all sides could come together
> around. The democracy movement extends far beyond the dialogue and
> deliberation sphere. It includes those who care about electoral  
> reform,
> community service, media reform, campaign finance, community  
> organizing, and
> youth engagement. While there is certainly much to disagree about with
> regard to approaches for engaging the public in the governance process
> through deliberation and dialogue, I would argue that if we don't  
> recognize
> that there is a broader democracy movement out there that needs to be
> brought in we will not get very far.
>
> That said, there is certainly a wide range of things that could be  
> added to
> such an agenda. Those who want to advocate for more robust  
> democratic reform
> should certainly do so. There is a window of opportunity for  
> influence right
> now, so I hope everyone is doing what they  can to try to take  
> advantage of it.
>
> With regard to Kenoli's larger critique of AmericaSpeaks and our  
> work, I'll
> keep my comment to this:
>
> Everyone who does this work of citizen engagement understands that the
> design of public engagement mechanisms is wrought with difficult  
> trade offs
> about values that we all care about. We care about diversity and  
> reaching
> those who normally do not have a voice. We care about public  
> influence and
> impact. We care about informed participation and judgment.... the  
> list goes
> on. Unfortunately, it is generally the case that as practitioners we  
> must
> make strategic and tactical choices that try to find some balance  
> between
> these often competing values. More often than not, a strategic  
> choice about
> the length of a forum, the structure of a question or the recruitment
> tactics used to get people in a room put values that we care about  
> into
> conflict. It is certainly the case that we at AmericaSpeaks tend to
> prioritize some values like public influence on the policy making  
> process
> before other values that would involve robust interpersonal consensus
> building. I think this is a defensible approach, but certainly not  
> the only
> way to go. But in the case of the California health care example  
> that Kenoli
> mentioned, 40 percent of participants ended up contacting their  
> legislators
> afterwards and an independent evaluation found that policy makers were
> influenced by what the public had to say. Does that meet everyone's  
> highest
> goals of co-intelligent policy making? Certainly not, but one can  
> certainly
> argue for its value and place in improving the policy making process.
>
> All of that said, I would encourage everyone to do what they can to  
> take
> advantage of this unique opportunity in our nation's history --  
> whether it
> be at the grassroots level or inside the beltway. These are exciting  
> times.
>
> Joe
> _________________________________
>
> Joe Goldman
>
> Vice President of Citizen Engagement AmericaSpeaks
>
> 1050 17th Street, NW, Suite 350
>
> Washington, DC 20036
>
> ph: 202-775-3939, x1002
>
> fax: 202-775-0404
>
> em: [log in to unmask]
>
> web: www.americaspeaks.org
>
>
>
> Engaging Citizens in Governance
>
> ---
>
> NCDD's discussion and announcement lists are generously provided by  
> L-Soft ( www.lsoft.com ) and are powered by L-Soft's LISTSERV  
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> community section of the NCDD website ( www.thataway.org/community/lists/ 
>  ).  Please read this mailing list's rules (
www.thataway.org/community/listrules 
>  ) before you post.

---

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July 2011, Week 1
June 2011, Week 5
June 2011, Week 4
June 2011, Week 3
June 2011, Week 2
June 2011, Week 1
May 2011, Week 5
May 2011, Week 4
May 2011, Week 3
May 2011, Week 2
May 2011, Week 1
April 2011, Week 5
April 2011, Week 4
April 2011, Week 3
April 2011, Week 2
April 2011, Week 1
March 2011, Week 5
March 2011, Week 4
March 2011, Week 3
March 2011, Week 2
March 2011, Week 1
February 2011, Week 4
February 2011, Week 3
February 2011, Week 2
February 2011, Week 1
January 2011, Week 4
January 2011, Week 3
January 2011, Week 2
January 2011, Week 1
December 2010, Week 5
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December 2010, Week 1
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November 2010, Week 4
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October 2010, Week 4
October 2010, Week 3
October 2010, Week 2
October 2010, Week 1
September 2010, Week 5
September 2010, Week 4
September 2010, Week 3
September 2010, Week 2
September 2010, Week 1
August 2010, Week 5
August 2010, Week 4
August 2010, Week 3
August 2010, Week 2
August 2010, Week 1
July 2010, Week 5
July 2010, Week 4
July 2010, Week 3
July 2010, Week 2
July 2010, Week 1
June 2010, Week 5
June 2010, Week 4
June 2010, Week 3
June 2010, Week 2
June 2010, Week 1
May 2010, Week 5
May 2010, Week 4
May 2010, Week 3
May 2010, Week 2
May 2010, Week 1
April 2010, Week 5
April 2010, Week 4
April 2010, Week 3
April 2010, Week 2
April 2010, Week 1
March 2010, Week 5
March 2010, Week 4
March 2010, Week 3
March 2010, Week 2
March 2010, Week 1
February 2010, Week 4
February 2010, Week 3
February 2010, Week 2
February 2010, Week 1
January 2010, Week 5
January 2010, Week 4
January 2010, Week 3
January 2010, Week 2
January 2010, Week 1
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December 2009, Week 2
December 2009, Week 1
November 2009, Week 5
November 2009, Week 4
November 2009, Week 3
November 2009, Week 2
November 2009, Week 1
October 2009, Week 5
October 2009, Week 4
October 2009, Week 3
October 2009, Week 2
October 2009, Week 1
September 2009, Week 5
September 2009, Week 4
September 2009, Week 3
September 2009, Week 2
September 2009, Week 1
August 2009, Week 5
August 2009, Week 4
August 2009, Week 3
August 2009, Week 2
August 2009, Week 1
July 2009, Week 5
July 2009, Week 4
July 2009, Week 3
July 2009, Week 2
July 2009, Week 1
June 2009, Week 5
June 2009, Week 4
June 2009, Week 3
June 2009, Week 2
June 2009, Week 1
May 2009, Week 5
May 2009, Week 4
May 2009, Week 3
May 2009, Week 2
May 2009, Week 1
April 2009, Week 5
April 2009, Week 4
April 2009, Week 3
April 2009, Week 2
April 2009, Week 1
March 2009, Week 4
March 2009, Week 3
March 2009, Week 2
March 2009, Week 1
February 2009, Week 4
February 2009, Week 3
February 2009, Week 2
February 2009, Week 1
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January 2009, Week 4
January 2009, Week 3
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December 2008, Week 5
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November 2008, Week 1
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October 2008, Week 3
October 2008, Week 2
October 2008, Week 1
September 2008, Week 5
September 2008, Week 4
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September 2008, Week 2
September 2008, Week 1
August 2008, Week 4
August 2008, Week 3
August 2008, Week 2
August 2008, Week 1
July 2008, Week 5
July 2008, Week 4
July 2008, Week 3
July 2008, Week 2
June 2008, Week 5
June 2008, Week 4
June 2008, Week 3
June 2008, Week 2
June 2008, Week 1
May 2008, Week 4
May 2008, Week 3
May 2008, Week 2
May 2008, Week 1
April 2008, Week 5
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April 2008, Week 3
April 2008, Week 2
April 2008, Week 1
March 2008, Week 5
March 2008, Week 4
March 2008, Week 3
March 2008, Week 2
March 2008, Week 1
February 2008, Week 5
February 2008, Week 4
February 2008, Week 3
February 2008, Week 2
February 2008, Week 1
January 2008, Week 5
January 2008, Week 4
January 2008, Week 3
January 2008, Week 2
January 2008, Week 1
December 2007, Week 4
December 2007, Week 3
December 2007, Week 2
December 2007, Week 1
November 2007, Week 4
November 2007, Week 3
November 2007, Week 2
November 2007, Week 1
October 2007, Week 5
October 2007, Week 4
October 2007, Week 3
October 2007, Week 2
October 2007, Week 1
September 2007, Week 4
September 2007, Week 3
September 2007, Week 2
September 2007, Week 1
August 2007, Week 5
August 2007, Week 4
August 2007, Week 3
August 2007, Week 2
July 2007, Week 4
July 2007, Week 3
July 2007, Week 2
July 2007, Week 1
June 2007, Week 5
June 2007, Week 4
June 2007, Week 3
June 2007, Week 2
June 2007, Week 1
May 2007, Week 4
May 2007, Week 3
May 2007, Week 2
May 2007, Week 1
April 2007, Week 5
April 2007, Week 4
April 2007, Week 3
April 2007, Week 2
April 2007, Week 1
March 2007, Week 4
March 2007, Week 3
March 2007, Week 1
February 2007, Week 4
February 2007, Week 3
February 2007, Week 2
February 2007, Week 1
January 2007, Week 5
January 2007, Week 4
January 2007, Week 3
January 2007, Week 2
January 2007, Week 1
December 2006, Week 4
December 2006, Week 3
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November 2006, Week 1
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October 2006, Week 2
October 2006, Week 1
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September 2006, Week 2
September 2006, Week 1
July 2006, Week 5
July 2006, Week 4
July 2006, Week 3
June 2006, Week 4
June 2006, Week 3
June 2006, Week 2
June 2006, Week 1
May 2006, Week 5
May 2006, Week 4
May 2006, Week 2
May 2006, Week 1
April 2006, Week 3
April 2006, Week 2
April 2006, Week 1
March 2006, Week 4
March 2006, Week 3

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